Bug 613898

Summary: hal is not started for the first boot after complete install
Product: [openSUSE] openSUSE 11.3 Reporter: Jean-Daniel Dodin <jdd>
Component: KDE4 ApplicationsAssignee: E-mail List <kde-maintainers>
Status: RESOLVED FIXED QA Contact: E-mail List <qa-bugs>
Severity: Critical    
Priority: P1 - Urgent CC: aj, antonvdh, Arnold.Panzenboeck, civil, EagleScreen, javier, jrobiso2, lee_matheson, martin.schlander, novellbmw, opensuse.lietuviu.kalba, ramib85, suse-beta, vivek.ap+novell, vkrevs, wstephenson
Version: Milestone 7   
Target Milestone: ---   
Hardware: 32bit   
OS: openSUSE 11.3   
See Also: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=591654
https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=613398
https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=615446
https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=615463
Whiteboard:
Found By: --- Services Priority:
Business Priority: Blocker: ---
Marketing QA Status: --- IT Deployment: ---
Attachments: yast logs before rebooting

Description Jean-Daniel Dodin 2010-06-14 07:54:56 UTC
User-Agent:       Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; fr; rv:1.9.2.4) Gecko/20100527 SUSE/3.6.4-2.2 Firefox/3.0.3, Ant.com Toolbar 1.1

When first trying to use 11.3 (just before RC1), I notice no of my devices where visible. K3b complain that hal was not started, and in fact "rchal status" shown it was not started;

Went to YaST, runlevels, to see Hal was quoted "yes*". I could there start Hal without problem and now all works.

Reproducible: Didn't try

Steps to Reproduce:
I have a BD write running, I will restart after that and see if hal is now started
Comment 1 Jean-Daniel Dodin 2010-06-14 07:57:42 UTC
Created attachment 368879 [details]
yast logs before rebooting
Comment 2 Andreas Jaeger 2010-06-14 08:29:27 UTC
KDE Maintainers, do we need hal running for KDE?  We do not need it in general anymore...
Comment 3 Jonathon Robison 2010-06-14 10:26:18 UTC
It certainly appears that K3B needs it . . .
Comment 4 Lubos Lunak 2010-06-14 12:40:54 UTC
Yes, we do need HAL for device support, there's no support for udisks or whatever the latest name of it is.

And HAL not starting is not a KDE bug -> reassigning.
Comment 5 Andreas Jaeger 2010-06-14 13:04:04 UTC
Lubos, could you file a feature request for KDE so that it does not use hal anymore and use udisks etc?
Comment 6 Will Stephenson 2010-06-14 14:24:41 UTC
aj: Upstream is aware of the need for u* backends and is working on necessary refactorings to allow this.

However there is no support for u* in KDE SC 4.4.

e have to keep hal on 11.3 except the GNOME LiveCD.
Comment 7 Andreas Jaeger 2010-06-15 07:35:01 UTC
So, if it's installed, it should be enabled - and KDE requires it but GNOME does not require it (and therefore will not install it).
Comment 8 Jean-Daniel Dodin 2010-06-15 08:22:04 UTC
I notice I didn't said that this was a *lxde* install, not kde. k3b was installed from YaST after that (I expected it to be the 2.0 version, said to be able to write BD)

What was disturbing me was that haldaemon was "yes*" in YaST runlevels, but not started (rchal was available).

I will try to see if it starts on other starts
Comment 9 Jean-Daniel Dodin 2010-06-15 08:37:56 UTC
so... I started 11.3 and it worked (hal started).

The steps I did at from the beginning:
1) installed 11.3 M7 lxde
2) installed k3b - error message: no devices found
3) run rchal status: stopped
4) run YaST runlevels: haldaemon yes*
5) switched to expert view, start daemon now

reboot (day after): hal runs.

so it seems that hal was installed (may be a k3b dependency) but not started. Had to reboot (like W* ? :-))
Comment 10 Jean-Daniel Dodin 2010-06-15 09:31:41 UTC
 sorry, I'm really tired and made several installs, so I sometime don't exactly remember what I did. Now I run a kde install so my previous comment 8 & 9 should be ignored
Comment 11 Martin Schlander 2010-06-18 13:41:05 UTC
I did two fresh installations of RC1 - one KDE Live x86 and one DVD x86_64 with KDE.

On neither installation is HAL installed nor running of course by default which means no detection and automounting of removable devices, the battery widget is non-functional etc.

In other words, this bug couldn't be more critical...
Comment 12 Stephan Kulow 2010-06-18 13:46:07 UTC
k3b should require hal
Comment 13 Christian Boltz 2010-06-18 23:05:11 UTC
http://en.opensuse.org/Bugs:Most_Annoying_Bugs_11.3_dev#openSUSE_11.3_RC1 says:
    for KDE desktop this means : no detection and automounting of removable 
    devices, the battery widget is non-functional etc. 

-> this bug is not limited to burning CDs, and therefore it is NOT enough if 
   k3b requires hal. (At least if the description quoted above is correct. 
   I didn't test myself ;-)
Comment 14 Martin Schlander 2010-06-19 06:31:32 UTC
Not only is it not started, it is not *installed* - on neither type of media.
Comment 15 John Webster 2010-06-19 06:49:05 UTC
In my experience, there are two significant installation problems arising from the absence of HAL packages in the KDE-based LiveCD images for RC1. The problems do not affect the corresponding Gnome-based images.

The first problem is that, unless and until the OS has been installed to a hard disk, and the missing packages have been manually identified and added to the installation, USB sticks will not be mounted automatically.

The second problem is that, in the absence of the relevant HAL packages, the OS cannot be installed using a LiveUSB stick, whether that stick has been created by the usual "dd" technique or through UNetBootin. This is particularly inconvenient when installing to a netbook.

While I agree that an upstream fix would be highly desirable in the medium term, I believe that, in the interests of less-experienced users, this bug should be treated as being a release blocker, and an appropriate fix put in place.
Comment 16 Vadim Krevs 2010-06-19 10:41:35 UTC
Also this makes it impossible to use openSUSE 11.3 Rc1 in a virtual box environment as there is no way to install virtual box additions ...

It's amazing that an issue so severe had not been found before RC1 media was out ...
Comment 17 Lee Matheson 2010-06-19 10:56:12 UTC
(In reply to comment #16)

> It's amazing that an issue so severe had not been found before RC1 media was
> out ...
Well, these things happen wrt all of us.  I have many external hard drives and memory sticks, and typically hot plug USB automount is something I always check as soon as possible in an openSUSE release during development. But I've been focused on the LXDE release for 11.3 and I did not pay attention to hotplug automounting of USB sticks until RC1 when I finally decided to test KDE in a bit more detail.  I suspect there is a similar story for others.
Comment 18 Jean-Daniel Dodin 2010-06-19 11:15:29 UTC
Well... the problem may be different then what is said here.

Sure, hal is not started. If we install/start hal all is nice. This is a good workaround.

But finally, the problem is not that. The problem is that all should work *without* hal. So it's the other way round: what don't work that should? I've seen a discussion on the mailing list, but didn't read the thread.

jdd
Comment 19 Mindaugas Baranauskas 2010-06-19 16:45:50 UTC
I created a branch of this bug to KDE4 ( BUG#615632 )

Gnome is well.

What about pure LXDE, XFCE?..
Comment 20 Lee Matheson 2010-06-20 05:50:01 UTC
(In reply to comment #19)
> Gnome is well.
> 
> What about pure LXDE, XFCE?..

I've been told that LXDE uses xfce battery manager that requires as dependency HAL, and hence HAL will be automatically installed on LXDE.
Comment 21 Kay Sievers 2010-06-20 11:06:09 UTC
(In reply to comment #19)
> I created a branch of this bug to KDE4 ( BUG#615632 )
> 
> Gnome is well.

GNOME does need HAL only fore rare hardware support. It should not be in the default anymore, but just pulled-in by dependencies, which should already work today.
Comment 22 Kay Sievers 2010-06-20 11:27:32 UTC
I guess KDE's 'solid' should depend on 'hal'.
Comment 23 Bernhard Wiedemann 2010-06-20 13:09:48 UTC
I think, there is already some fix in factory as hal is installed and running when installing with post-RC1
http://download.opensuse.org/factory/iso/openSUSE-KDE-LiveCD-x86_64-Build0679-Media.iso

A workaround for those who installed MS7/RC1, could be thus:
sudo zypper in hal ; sudo /sbin/insserv haldaemon ; sudo /sbin/reboot
Comment 24 Mindaugas Baranauskas 2010-06-20 13:25:23 UTC
The title of this bug is „hal is not started for the first boot after complete install“.
So the problem is that:
after hal package installation, haldaemon don't start immediately. 
Solution of original bug issue: 
hal package installation should trigger haldaemon 
(or inform "reboot as soon as possible" after installation).
Comment 25 Mindaugas Baranauskas 2010-06-20 13:31:03 UTC
(In reply to comment #23)
> I think, there is already some fix in factory as hal is installed and running
> when installing with post-RC1
> http://download.opensuse.org/factory/iso/openSUSE-KDE-LiveCD-x86_64-Build0679-Media.iso
> 
> A workaround for those who installed MS7/RC1, could be thus:
> sudo zypper in hal ; sudo /sbin/insserv haldaemon ; sudo /sbin/reboot
Comment 26 Stephan Kulow 2010-06-20 17:28:50 UTC
it's in the default install now because kdelibs4 recommends it.
Comment 27 Lubos Lunak 2010-06-22 12:54:58 UTC
*** Bug 615347 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Comment 28 Lubos Lunak 2010-06-22 13:00:23 UTC
*** Bug 615684 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Comment 29 Lubos Lunak 2010-06-22 13:03:12 UTC
*** Bug 613849 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Comment 30 Lubos Lunak 2010-06-28 15:51:19 UTC
*** Bug 617752 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Comment 31 Lubos Lunak 2010-06-28 15:51:41 UTC
*** Bug 617895 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Comment 32 Jean-Daniel Dodin 2010-07-04 17:42:42 UTC
(In reply to comment #26)
> it's in the default install now because kdelibs4 recommends it.

AFAIK, when I hit the problem, hal *was* installed but not started (read the first description)

jdd